Re: external image of SPIP, compared to other CMS : what do you think about it ?

Hi Klaus,

On 15/06/2009, at 3:18 PM, klaus++ wrote:

> Dear Thomas,
>
> thank you for pointig out so precisely the main issue for the  
> further development of SPIP. It makes me feel better that the large  
> number of hours I used to figure out (mostly perfect) solutions are  
> not so much due to my lack of programming skills but rather a  
> common phenomenon.

I have spent a large amount of time learning how, e.g., the plug-in  
system works, largely by trial-and-error, reading the code, and this  
mailing list. I'm starting to see that pay off now as I help my  
colleagues learn how it works and can have them take over maintenance  
of our internal code, but it was a very long hard struggle.

And now I have to re-learn parts of it for SPIP 2.0, a task which I'm  
not anticipating.

> I have been usin SPIP from it's very beginning and still admire the  
> well focused concepts behind but I have had a hard time recently  
> trying to follow the developments an the core side. At this moment  
> they are likely to do another great job which we all have been  
> asking for : they are splitting up the code into a real core which  
> drives plugins providing the functions we arer using. But in the  
> same time I feel a bit unhappy about this happening without being  
> documented right from the beginning of this step.

I have never bothered trying to follow core developments. It is  
useless to follow the development without knowing the existing  
system, and the only ways I can see to learn some parts of it is  
either flood this list with hundreds of questions or spend some days  
or weeks reading the code. Frankly, neither is appealing.

I'd like to know more about SPIP and the way it works, but it's just  
too hard at the moment and my boss can't afford to pay me to sit here  
and learn it. 

> Although one of my main arguments for using SPIP is it's  
> independence from institutional or commercial influences (yes, it  
> still is a very political project) this seems to be one of the  
> reasons for our problem : the way the SPIP community works does not  
> follow the necessities of a professional project and therefore does  
> not easily decide to adopt a mature client-centered attitude.

My comments were not to say that I think SPIP's development should be  
driven by commercial issues, but I don't think that these issues are  
particular to commercial projects; they apply to *all* projects,  
especially large ones. SPIP is clearly of a size (about 16 MB, though  
 > 8 MB is translations) where it is unfeasible for a newcomer to  
learn everything they need to from the code.

> We shall discuss this intensively at the Avignon meeting and I am  
> optimistic about the results.

Good luck! Any improvement at all would be a good thing from my point  
of view.

Regards,

Thomas Sutton

Web Developer
bouncingorange
graphic + web design