Sudipto Ganguly | 3 Jan 20:48 2004
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Re: Re: Jaimala Gold by Pancham : and his Hindi


Vinay,
If You can check the archives with AIR, There must be another Jaymala
Programme Presented by RDB which was recorded in the early eighties, As far
as I remember songs from Khel khel Me "Ek mai aur ek tu" where RDB has
mentioned a brief story about how that particular song was written  and "Om
Shaanti Om" from Karz as a tribute to Laxmikant, were part of that
programme. It was aired sometimes during the late eighties.I dont rememmber
the other songs but may be other members can.
Regards,
Sudipto
----- Original Message -----
From: "Vinay" <v9y@...>
To: <pancham@...>
Sent: Friday, September 03, 2004 9:59 PM
Subject: [Pancham] Re: Jaimala Gold by Pancham : and his Hindi

> Dikshit:
>
> I agree on all points.
>
> That made me check Panchamonline trivia which mentions two Jaimalas
> presented by him. By the song-list it appears that the Jaimala re-
> aired recently was the one that was originally aired in July 1968
> and not in 1971 (Pavan, can you confirm? What made you say that it
> was aired in 1971 - possibly the announcement before the
> programme?). The songs played were also from films released in or
> before 1968.
>
> About MSY, I think one cannot deny Pancham's own humbleness as a
> factor for his speaking less on the programme. Remember the
> programme was officially about *him*. And you can expect many things
> from Pancham but not talking about himself in glorifying manner. In
> fact, even when he opens his mouth he feels more enthusiastic
> talking about his father or Gulzar or Asha or LP or Madan Mohan than
> himself. Naturally Asha and Gulzar had a bigger role to play. But I
> still agree that at times it felt like Pancham could have said a few
> things more (or, Gulzar and Asha could have encouraged him a little
> more).
>
> Vinay
>
> --- In pancham@..., "Dikshit Arya" <dickrus7 <at> y...> wrote:
> >
> > Vinay,
> >
> > One must bear in mind that Jaimala was 'the' programme during
> those
> > days. It also was a sort of acknowledgement that one had arrived.
> > AIR being govt contrlled a script approved by some official could
> be
> > a requirement. For Pm it was probably his first appearance and his
> > stiffness is understandable. Yet every word is very much
> indicative
> > of Pm. He is different from most others who have appeared on AIR.
> > Notice he has made no pious noises about fauji bhais. It is often
> > galling to hear every second person announcing that but for his
> > choice of profession he would have been in the army as if the army
> > would admit him. Pm's approach is direct, anecdotal and
> establishes
> > intimacy with the listener  and typically of him he remains
> humble.
> > He may not have the flair of a Gulzarsab, but unlike him  tells
> more
> > stories and reveals more of himself.  If there is one tiny
> criticism
> > one can make of MSY it is that Gulzar saab and Ashaji should have
> > let Pm have more say than he did.
> >
> > Dikshit
> >
> >
> > --- In pancham@..., "Vinay" <v9y <at> y...> wrote:
> > > --- In pancham@..., "asadkidwai" <asadkidwai <at> y...>
> > wrote:
> > > > --- In pancham@..., "Vinay" <v9y <at> y...> wrote:
> > > > > --- In pancham@..., "Pavan Jha" <pavanjha <at> r...>
> > > wrote:
> > > > > > clear... He did surprised me with the use of many Hindi
> > words
> > > > like
> > > > > Avashya,
> > > > > > Arth, Prastut, Upjaau and Anginat.. Also his
> pronounciation
> > > was
> > > > > very clear
> > > > > > unlike other interviews and I missed the typical (and
> > > awkward)
> > > > > bangla
> > > > > > flavor in his hindi narration.. Did his pronounciation got
> > > > changed
> > > > > in the
> > > > > > later part of career?
> > > > > >
> > > > >
> > > > > I think it can be attributed to a possible 'rehearsed-
> > recording'
> > > > of
> > > > > the show as opposed to the casual talk of the MSY. The use
> of
> > > some
> > > > > of the formal Hindi words also suggests that it might have
> > been
> > > a
> > > > > scripted show. Of course it doesn't have to be written by
> > > someone
> > > > > else. In fact, as I said before, the tone and content is
> very
> > > much
> > > > > similar to as he spoke in MSY and in all likeliness he might
> > > have
> > > > > prepared it himself with some possible editorial help. From
> my
> > > > > experience of listening to Jaimalas, I think that's how it
> > works
> > > > > normally (with other guests) too.
> > > >
> > > > Vinay, I think you are right about the Jaimalas...but an
> > > observation
> > > > I would like to share. During one of Ameen Sayani's programmes
> > on
> > > > Rafi..Pancham paid a tribute to him and said...unke saath
> kabhi
> > > koi
> > > > badmazgi naheen hoti thee. Now he said without any Bangla
> > accent,
> > > > and badmazgi is an Urdu word which is not used very
> frequently.
> > So
> > > > maybe it is possible that he knew better Hindi/Urdu/Hindustani
> > > than
> > > > we think he did?
> > >
> > > I agree with you. I think he had fairly good command over the
> > > language for a common speaker in Mumbai (after all he was
> Gulzar's
> > > friend :)). Accent is something else though and it is not
> uncommon
> > > for a Hindi speaker to reflect his native language/dialect
> through
> > > that. I think one could tell that by listening to Pancham's
> Hindi
> > > too (in casual conversations). At the same time it was pretty
> > subtle
> > > by the standards of SDB's Hindi pronunciation (of what I have
> > heard
> > > about it).
> > >
> > > However, getting back to the present context, I think Pavan is
> > > right. Pancham sounds very different in this program (recorded
> in
> > > 1971) than his later recordings. One reason is of course that
> the
> > > program was scripted. I listened to the program (thanks to
> Pavan)
> > > and it is clear that Pancham is reading the written word. In
> fact,
> > I
> > > would even go on to say that it was a very poor performance on
> his
> > > part :). One of the rare instances when I would rather prefer
> the
> > > written transcript than listening to the program. But on the
> > > positive side, you can see how 'clear' his voice was at that
> > time.
> > > Strangely, for a few (only few and passing) moments I thought I
> > was
> > > listening to Kishore. On the whole, if you missed listening to
> the
> > > Jaimala, never mind. The transcript posted by Pavan is all that
> > you
> > > would want.
> > >
> > > Vinay
>
>
>
>
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Gmane